On Mueller report, Trump is ‘completely clueless,’ says Jeffries
2019-04-18 00:00:00


JUDY WOODRUFF: We turn to congressional reactionto the report now with the chairman of the(1)
JUDY WOODRUFF:我们现在转向国会对该报告的反应

House Democratic Caucus.(2)
民主党核心小组。

He is Representative Hakeem Jeffries of NewYork.(3)
他是纽约的代表哈基姆杰弗里斯。

He's also a member of the Judiciary Committee.(4)
他也是司法委员会的成员。

Congressman Jeffries, thank you very muchfor talking with us.(5)
国会议员杰弗里斯,非常感谢你和我们交谈。

President Trump says this proves, again, thathe is exonerated.(6)
特朗普总统说,这再次证明他是无罪的。

REP.(7)
REP。

HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY): Well, the presidentis completely clueless.(8)
HAKEEM JEFFRIES(D-NY):总统是完全无能为力的。

And, once again, he's lying to the Americanpeople.(9)
而且,他又一次向美国人民撒谎。

If anything, the Mueller report is exactlythe opposite.(10)
如果有的话,穆勒报告恰恰相反。

It is incredibly, deeply troubling, the informationthat is contained in that report.(11)
令人难以置信的是,令人难以置信的是,该报告中包含的信息令人深感不安。

The president, pursuant to the United StatesConstitution, is charged with faithfully executing(12)
根据美国宪法,总统负责忠实执行

the laws of the United States of America.(13)
美利坚合众国的法律。

The information in the Mueller report revealsthat, in at least 10 instances, the president(14)
穆勒报告中的信息显示,至少在10个案例中,总统

likely engaged in obstruction of justice.(15)
可能是妨碍司法公正。

That is a serious crime.(16)
这是一个严重的罪行。

What we need to do now is hear from Bob Mueller,so that the American people can make a determination(17)
我们现在需要做的是听听Bob Mueller,以便美国人民能够做出决定

for themselves as to how we proceed to bringabout some accountability.(18)
为了我们如何着手实现一些问责制。

JUDY WOODRUFF: Well, I want to ask you aboutwhat the Congress' role is next.(19)
JUDY WOODRUFF:嗯,我想问你下一步国会的作用。

But, at this point, do you accept the specialcounsel's finding that there are no more indictments(20)
但是,在这一点上,你是否接受特别律师的裁定,即没有更多的起诉书

to come of either the president himself oranybody close to him?(21)
无论是总统本人还是与他亲近的人?

REP.(22)
REP。

HAKEEM JEFFRIES: Yes, Bob Mueller, as we havemaintained from the very beginning, is a highly(23)
HAKEEM JEFFRIES:是的,正如我们从一开始就保持的那样,Bob Mueller是一位高度评价的人

respected law enforcement professional.(24)
尊重执法专业人士。

I believe he conducted himself in an appropriatefashion as it relates to how he handled this(25)
我相信他以适当的方式表现自己,因为它与他如何处理这个问题有关

investigation.(26)
调查。

I take him at his word with respect to hisconclusion that the acts that occurred as(27)
我接受他关于他所得到的行为的结论

between the Trump campaign and Russian operativesdidn't rise to the level of being able to(28)
特朗普竞选活动与俄罗斯特工之间没有达到能够达到的程度

prove beyond a reasonable doubt that therewas a criminal conspiracy that existed, but(29)
超出合理怀疑证明存在犯罪阴谋,但是

also take seriously the allegations that helaid out and the information that was presented(30)
还要认真对待他提出的指控和所提供的信息

with respect to the acts of obstruction ofjustice.(31)
关于阻挠司法的行为。

And now we have to take that information,get the underlying documentation, and eventually(32)
现在我们必须获取该信息,获取底层文档,并最终获得

hear from him before the House Judiciary Committee.(33)
在众议院司法委员会听取他的意见。

JUDY WOODRUFF: So you're saying you don'taccept his conclusion that he couldn't -- or,(34)
JUDY WOODRUFF:所以你说你不接受他的结论,他不能 - 或者,

rather, you don't accept what he said, thathe couldn't reach a conclusion about whether(35)
相反,你不接受他说的话,他无法得出结论

or not there was obstruction of justice committed?(36)
是否存在妨碍司法的障碍?

REP.(37)
REP。

HAKEEM JEFFRIES: Well, what appears to bethe conclusion that he reached is that, based(38)
HAKEEM JEFFRIES:嗯,他所达成的结论似乎是基于

on a variety of different factors, includinglongstanding Department of Justice practice(39)
关于各种不同因素,包括长期司法部的实践

that you cannot indict a sitting president,along with the observation that, notwithstanding(40)
你不能起诉一位现任总统,尽管有这样的观察

that fact, they were going to preserve theevidence of obstruction of justice for both(41)
事实上,他们将保留两者妨碍司法公正的证据

Congress and presumably a future Departmentof Justice to consider once Donald Trump is(42)
国会和大概是唐纳德特朗普曾经考虑的未来司法部

no longer president of the United States ofthe United States of America.(43)
不再是美利坚合众国美国总统。

To me, that's not the end.(44)
对我来说,这不是结束。

That's just the beginning of what needs tocome next.(45)
这只是接下来需要的开始。

JUDY WOODRUFF: So, when you say you're goingto call the special counsel, Bob Mueller,(46)
JUDY WOODRUFF:所以,当你说要打电话给特别律师Bob Mueller时

before Congress, what do you think you canget from him that he hasn't already laid out?(47)
在国会之前,你认为你可以从他那里得到什么?

He spent two years working on this report.(48)
他花了两年时间研究这份报告。

What more do you think you can hear from him,learn from him?(49)
你还能从他那里听到什么,向他学习?

REP.(50)
REP。

HAKEEM JEFFRIES: It's a great question.(51)
HAKEEM JEFFRIES:这是一个很好的问题。

One, we don't have the underlying documentationin this exhaustive report.(52)
第一,我们在这份详尽的报告中没有基础文件。

We also have only been presented with a redactedversion that was undertaken by the attorney(53)
我们还只提供了由律师进行的编辑版本

general, who clearly is not acting like thepeople's attorney.(54)
将军,显然不像人民律师那样行事。

He's acting like Trump's publicist.(55)
他的表现就像特朗普的公关人员。

So, at this particular point in time, we can'tsimply accept the redacted version of what(56)
所以,在这个特定的时间点,我们不能简单地接受编辑后的版本

was presented to Congress and the Americanpeople today.(57)
今天提交给国会和美国人民。

We need an unredacted version.(58)
我们需要一个未编辑的版本。

We need the underlying documentation.(59)
我们需要底层文档。

And, ultimately, we need Bob Mueller to explainthe report to the American people and the(60)
而且,最终,我们需要Bob Mueller向美国人民和美国人民解释这份报告

principal findings and conclusions.(61)
主要调查结果和结论。

JUDY WOODRUFF: So, when you say the wholereport, I mean, as you know, the redacted(62)
JUDY WOODRUFF:所以,当你说整个报告时,我的意思是,如你所知,编辑

portions include grand jury testimony.(63)
部分内容包括大陪审团的证词。

It includes material that we are told is confidential,it's part of intelligence or intelligence(64)
它包括我们被告知是保密的材料,它是情报或情报的一部分

gathering.(65)
搜集。

You're saying you want to just basically ignorethose concerns, those restrictions?(66)
你说你想基本上忽略那些担忧,那些限制?

REP.(67)
REP。

HAKEEM JEFFRIES: Well, there are two things.(68)
HAKEEM JEFFRIES:嗯,有两件事。

With respect to Congress, we have high levelsof security clearance, and so any member of(69)
关于国会,我们有高水平的安全许可,所以任何成员

Congress ought to be able to review the reportin its entirety.(70)
国会应该能够完整地审查该报告。

With respect to the American people, the HouseDemocrats have been very clear that we accept(71)
对于美国人民来说,众议院民主党人已经非常清楚我们接受了

the notion that redactions are appropriatein order to protect sources and methods connected(72)
为了保护相关的来源和方法,干预是合适的

to the intelligence community, so that wecan continue to promote the safety and security(73)
对情报界来说,这样我们就可以继续促进安全保障

of the American people.(74)
美国人民

However, as you know, with respect to grandjury material, that's a very different story.(75)
但是,正如您所知,关于大陪审团的材料,这是一个非常不同的故事。

There is a presumption of privacy.(76)
有隐私的推定。

However, the law permits that presumptionto be overcome when there is a compelling(77)
但是,法律允许在有令人信服的情况下克服推定

public interest.(78)
公共利益。

Seventeen different intelligence agenciesconcluded that Russia attacked our democracy(79)
17个不同的情报机构得出结论,俄罗斯袭击了我们的民主

and interfered with our election to try andartificially place Donald Trump at 1600 Pennsylvania(80)
并且干涉了我们的选举,试图在宾夕法尼亚州1600年人为地安置唐纳德特朗普

Avenue.(81)
大街。

To me, this whole scenario involves a compellingpublic interest.(82)
对我来说,这整个场景涉及引人注目的公共利益。

That's why we need more information, not less.(83)
这就是我们需要更多信息而不是更少信息的原因。

JUDY WOODRUFF: And is that something thatwould potentially lead, in your opinion, to(84)
JUDY WOODRUFF:在您看来,这可能会带来什么

impeachment proceedings?(85)
弹劾程序?

REP.(86)
REP。

HAKEEM JEFFRIES: Well, impeachment is stilloff the table as it relates to how we're going(87)
HAKEEM JEFFRIES:嗯,弹劾仍然不在议事日程,因为它与我们的行为有关

to proceed.(88)
继续。

We just want to methodically collect the information.(89)
我们只想有条不紊地收集信息。

Nancy Pelosi has been clear with respect toimpeachment.(90)
南希佩洛西在弹劾方面一直很清楚。

She's laid out a standard that I accept andsupport, which is that the case must be compelling,(91)
她提出了一个我接受并支持的标准,即案件必须引人注目,

the evidence should be overwhelming, and thesentiment around impeachment must be bipartisan.(92)
证据应该是压倒性的,围绕弹劾的情绪必须是两党的。

We have gotten a lot closer to the case perhapsbeing compelling.(93)
我们已经越来越接近案件或许引人注目。

The evidence is being developed, but we stillhaven't hit the third prong, where public(94)
证据正在制定中,但我们还没有打到第三个公共场所

sentiment suggests that to have a presidentthat is engaged in this type of criminality(95)
情绪表明要有一位从事这种犯罪活动的总统

is no longer acceptable.(96)
不再可以接受。

We will see how the American people processthe information over the next few weeks, but(97)
我们将看到美国人民如何在接下来的几周内处理这些信息,但是

that's why it's important for us to hear fromBob Mueller directly.(98)
这就是我们直接听取Bob Mueller的重要信息。

JUDY WOODRUFF: But you're saying that whathappens after the Congress hears from the(99)
JUDY WOODRUFF:但你说的是国会听到会议后发生的事情

special counsel is something that could leadto prosecuting the president or finding him(100)
特别顾问可能会导致起诉总统或找到他

-- or trying to remove him from office?(101)
- 还是试图将他从办公室带走?

REP.(102)
REP。

HAKEEM JEFFRIES: No.(103)
HAKEEM JEFFRIES:不。

Well, the Department of Justice has been veryclear at this particular point in time, which(104)
那么,司法部在这个特定的时间点已经非常明确了

is to say that a sitting president cannotbe prosecuted, pursuant to Justice Department(105)
也就是说,根据司法部的说法,一位现任总统不能被起诉

practice.(106)
实践。

I accept that as the situation that we findourselves in.(107)
我接受这种情况,我们发现自己。

In terms of presidential accountability, Idon't think that we, as potential decision-makers(108)
在总统问责制方面,我不认为我们作为潜在的决策者

on the House Judiciary Committee, should cometo any conclusions, until we have gathered(109)
在众议院司法委员会,应该得出任何结论,直到我们聚集

all of the information.(110)
所有的信息。

And that's going to include a report freeof some of the redactions that are probably(111)
这将包括一份报告,其中没有一些可能的修改

overly broad.(112)
过于宽泛。

That will include the underlying documentation.(113)
这将包括底层文档。

That will include hearing from Bob Mueller.(114)
这将包括Bob Mueller的听证会。

JUDY WOODRUFF: Right.(115)
JUDY WOODRUFF:对。

REP.(116)
REP。

HAKEEM JEFFRIES: Until we get to that point,it's premature to discuss the potential of(117)
HAKEEM JEFFRIES:在我们达到这一点之前,讨论潜力尚为时过早

pursuing impeachment proceedings against thepresident.(118)
对总统进行弹劾程序。

JUDY WOODRUFF: Congressman Hakeem Jeffries,the chairman of the House Democratic Caucus,(119)
JUDY WOODRUFF:众议院民主党核心小组主席哈克姆杰弗里斯国会议员,

we thank you.(120)
我们谢谢你。

REP.(121)
REP。

HAKEEM JEFFRIES: Thank you very much.(122)
HAKEEM JEFFRIES:非常感谢。


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